from the official stream; unintended sneak peek of things to come

[Sailor_Moon]

16 hours ago, Nevermore135 said:

I certainly hope not: she won’t stand out at all at that crowded tier - there are five tier VII British BB premiums (four of them historical!) and two of them are Nelson and Collingwood (a Nelson variant with altered stats/gameplay characteristics). Tier VIII has just Vanguard, and there aren’t a lot of other “historical” options available either unless one wants another KGV hull (the historical Anson or Howe or the original 12-gun KGV design come to mind.)

The interesting thing about a tier VIII Rodney is that WG really wouldn’t have to change too much from Nelson to make her a competitive tier VIII. By far Nelson’s biggest weakness is her massive 26mm nose that is overmatched by so many BBs in her matchmaking spread. Give the ship 32mm plating, some AA buffs, and perhaps an extra knot of speed and she’d be in a pretty good place at tier VIII. It would also be easier to work in her historical torpedo armament at tier VIII, because it would be a bit of a shame if she didn’t have them to lob at Bismarcks in game.

Well you know how Wargaming does things, that's why I said Tier VII Rodney is the most likely option, but it's certainly not the best option. Like you said, I'd rather Rodney get uptiered to Tier VIII and get the 32mm plating and retain all the utility of Nelson with maybe the historical torpedo launchers added (so like the British battlecruiser line torpedoes?).

[Sailor_Moon]

16 hours ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

Car 54, Where Are You?  TV Series  1961–1963
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0054528/

Honestly, I think I-54 is coming in probably the update after the Halloween one along with the Russian subs. WoWs RU got it early, but we're BOTH getting the Halloween event at the same time. So it's very likely for us to get the sub update (and balance changes) AFTER Halloween.

OR you know, we could get the balance changes during the Halloween event update, that works too. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Nevermore135]

13 minutes ago, Sailor_Moon said:

Like you said, I'd rather Rodney get uptiered to Tier VIII and get the 32mm plating and retain all the utility of Nelson with maybe the historical torpedo launchers added (so like the British battlecruiser line torpedoes?).

The Nelson-class were armed with a single submerged torpedo tube on each side, so that would be the way to implement them in a historical manner, as well as in a manner where they are actually somewhat useful.

Edited September 16, 2023 by Nevermore135

[Sailor_Moon]

1 hour ago, Nevermore135 said:

The Nelson-class were armed with a single submerged torpedo tube on each side, so that would be the way to implement them in a historical manner, as well as in a manner where they are actually somewhat useful.

Yep, those are the ones :D

[Jakob Knight]

2 hours ago, Sailor_Moon said:

Honestly, I think I-54 is coming in probably the update after the Halloween one along with the Russian subs. WoWs RU got it early, but we're BOTH getting the Halloween event at the same time. So it's very likely for us to get the sub update (and balance changes) AFTER Halloween.

OR you know, we could get the balance changes during the Halloween event update, that works too. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

As Sealord mentioned in his video on it, the I-54 is going to have a unique problem in using aircraft.  It has to be surfaced.

 

A Sub that is on the surface, unattended or (worse) controlled by AI is in a terrible position.  If anything spots it, it is incapable of reacting before it's crippled or sunk.  But subs are meant to operate closer to the enemy than many other shiptypes in the game, which means it isn't going to be in the position of other hybrids where it can pull out of battle to use its planes.

 

Might be useful near the end game when the I-54 is on one side of the map and the enemy the other, but otherwise, I think its planes will be very risky (read:  today is a good day to die) to use.

 

 

Edited September 16, 2023 by Jakob Knight

[Sailor_Moon]

4 hours ago, Jakob Knight said:

 

As Sealord mentioned in his video on it, the I-54 is going to have a unique problem in using aircraft.  It has to be surfaced.

 

A Sub that is on the surface, unattended or (worse) controlled by AI is in a terrible position.  If anything spots it, it is incapable of reacting before it's crippled or sunk.  But subs are meant to operate closer to the enemy than many other shiptypes in the game, which means it isn't going to be in the position of other hybrids where it can pull out of battle to use its planes.

 

Might be useful near the end game when the I-54 is on one side of the map and the enemy the other, but otherwise, I think its planes will be very risky (read:  today is a good day to die) to use.

 

 

Well I didn't say it was gonna be a good idea, but there's just no way we're not getting it, that's what I'm saying. 😛

I just believe that we're "behind" WoWs RU on a few things, update-wise. WoWs RU got the balance changes and russian subs early, but that doesn't mean WE aren't gonna get them. I just can't see Wargaming passing up the chance to implement these things. If they don't implement the blaance changes, they're idiots. If they don't implement the russian subs, they'll "lose out" on monetization and yet another early access event for moar monies. Again, not happening 😛

Disclaimer: I'm not saying I want Russian subs AT ALL, but they're inevitable, knowing Wargaming.

[Wolfswetpaws]

16 hours ago, Jakob Knight said:

 

As Sealord mentioned in his video on it, the I-54 is going to have a unique problem in using aircraft.  It has to be surfaced.

 

A Sub that is on the surface, unattended or (worse) controlled by AI is in a terrible position.  If anything spots it, it is incapable of reacting before it's crippled or sunk.  But subs are meant to operate closer to the enemy than many other shiptypes in the game, which means it isn't going to be in the position of other hybrids where it can pull out of battle to use its planes.

 

Might be useful near the end game when the I-54 is on one side of the map and the enemy the other, but otherwise, I think its planes will be very risky (read:  today is a good day to die) to use.

Those of us who play both CV's and Hybrid-BB's/Cruisers/DD's will be familiar with the "risks", trade-offs and utility of the aircraft, though.

Setting the auto-pilot before or shortly after launching planes will be fine, as I see it.

Considering how the I-56 has the currently largest detection radius of Submarines in the game, I anticipate the I-54 will be similarly plagued with a small amount of dive-capacity and a huge detection radius and probably a large turning circle thrown-in as part of the entire package.

Getting surrounded and swarmed by red-team ships is not fun for any submarine.
So, "getting close" isn't likely to be the I-54's preferred play-style, even when not using planes. 

I figure the I-54 will find her niche, just as the Halford has.

Edited September 17, 2023 by Wolfswetpaws

[Yedwy]

12 hours ago, Jakob Knight said:

As Sealord mentioned in his video on it, the I-54 is going to have a unique problem in using aircraft.  It has to be surfaced.

Ahh will it now? it takes time to dive so whats stopping the driver to pres c 4 times then slams the plane launch key?

[EXEC_HYMNE_Ar_tonelico]

2 minutes ago, Yedwy said:

Ahh will it now? it takes time to dive so whats stopping the driver to pres c 4 times then slams the plane launch key?

that is interesting. Good point.

Maybe they will cancel the flight? But knowing WG I doubt that

[Wolfswetpaws]

3 hours ago, Yedwy said:

Ahh will it now? it takes time to dive so whats stopping the driver to pres c 4 times then slams the plane launch key?

 

3 hours ago, EXEC_HYMNE_Ar_tonelico said:

that is interesting. Good point.

Maybe they will cancel the flight? But knowing WG I doubt that

If memory serves me, the Japanese "carrier" submarines would launch planes and then might dive or remain on the surface and alert for enemy planes while their own planes were aloft.
What they did depended upon the conditions and the perceived risk at the time.
I figure players will make similar decisions in-game.

It will be interesting to see if the submarine can dive and remain submerged while the planes fly around.
But if a player makes an aerial attack or hits the "F" key to recall the planes while the submarine is submerged, then what will happen? 
The planes can't land?  Or they land near the submarine and cannot be recovered and serviced until the submarine surfaces?  🤔

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

3 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

 

If memory serves me, the Japanese "carrier" submarines would launch planes and then might dive or remain on the surface and alert for enemy planes while their own planes were aloft.
What they did depended upon the conditions and the perceived risk at the time.
I figure players will make similar decisions in-game.

It will be interesting to see if the submarine can dive and remain submerged while the planes fly around.
But if a player makes an aerial attack or hits the "F" key to recall the planes while the submarine is submerged, then what will happen? 
The planes can't land?  Or they land near the submarine and cannot be recovered and serviced until the submarine surfaces?  🤔

Consumable squadrons don't land on the ships.

The game is just an arcade...it isn't reality.

[Wolfswetpaws]

2 minutes ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

Consumable squadrons don't land on the ships.

The game is just an arcade...it isn't reality.

Good point.

[Comrade_Jimmy]

Anyone have the date and time stamp of this stream? I’m trying to find where this came from.

 

[Ensign Cthulhu]

On 9/16/2023 at 5:17 PM, Jakob Knight said:

 

As Sealord mentioned in his video on it, the I-54 is going to have a unique problem in using aircraft.  It has to be surfaced.

 

A Sub that is on the surface, unattended or (worse) controlled by AI is in a terrible position.  If anything spots it, it is incapable of reacting before it's crippled or sunk.  But subs are meant to operate closer to the enemy than many other shiptypes in the game, which means it isn't going to be in the position of other hybrids where it can pull out of battle to use its planes.

 

Might be useful near the end game when the I-54 is on one side of the map and the enemy the other, but otherwise, I think its planes will be very risky (read:  today is a good day to die) to use.

 

 

A lot revolves around what the plane is intended to do. If it's a rocket, bomber or torpedo plane then yes, expect to have to leave your hull unattended on the surface and take a risk. But if its function is ASW or Dutch-type airstrike, that's a different matter.

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

2 hours ago, Ensign Cthulhu said:

A lot revolves around what the plane is intended to do. If it's a rocket, bomber or torpedo plane then yes, expect to have to leave your hull unattended on the surface and take a risk. But if its function is ASW or Dutch-type airstrike, that's a different matter.

I don't think any hybrid ships planes actually return to the carrier...neither do the tier 11 consumable airstrikes...

I bet WG just makes the sub planes consumable and then the sub can do whatever it wants after launching them.

[Jakob Knight]

21 hours ago, Ensign Cthulhu said:

A lot revolves around what the plane is intended to do. If it's a rocket, bomber or torpedo plane then yes, expect to have to leave your hull unattended on the surface and take a risk. But if its function is ASW or Dutch-type airstrike, that's a different matter.

 

Maybe, though the problem still persists of when you would be flying your planes while either your Sub is sailing blissfully unattended on the surface or burning dive time with no one at the helm.  Since this is specifically noted as a hybrid, that seems a pretty good indicator that the planes will be manned and not an expendable attack.  Having ASW or normal AS consumables doesn't earn the hybrid designation, after all.

 

 

[Kynami]

I'm pretty sure it isn't going to be nearly as much wasted dive time as you might think. One can probably set an auto-pilot path from the map screen to start maneuvering towards where you want or need to be shortly while you take your consumable squadron around for some spotting and a strike delivery.

And as for hybrids its effectively tactical squadrons that always launch as a full group after a timer has filled. And you can't get an extra launch early because planes came back since they don't. So the sub being a hybrid likely just means it will be able to launch planes every couple minutes in addition to its other stuff.

This very likely is going to be an incredibly annoying pest when played well since it can play the spotting game at the other side of the map while doing area denial on the other and only needs to keep an eye on the mini-map a bit more.

[Gillhunter]

On 9/17/2023 at 8:41 AM, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

The game is just an arcade...it isn't reality.

And apparently becoming more and more so. 😔

[Jakob Knight]

17 hours ago, Kynami said:

I'm pretty sure it isn't going to be nearly as much wasted dive time as you might think. One can probably set an auto-pilot path from the map screen to start maneuvering towards where you want or need to be shortly while you take your consumable squadron around for some spotting and a strike delivery.

 

 

If this is going to be similar to the I-56, you'll have only about the time it will take to actually reach a target with your plane in dive time on a full charge, less any dive time already expended.  That's -alot- of wasted dive time if your Sub is anywhere near where it needs to be in order to be engaging the enemy with your torpedoes, not even saying what will happen if you are and put your Sub on AI control on the surface.

[Yedwy]

44 minutes ago, Jakob Knight said:

 

If this is going to be similar to the I-56, you'll have only about the time it will take to actually reach a target with your plane in dive time on a full charge, less any dive time already expended.  That's -alot- of wasted dive time if your Sub is anywhere near where it needs to be in order to be engaging the enemy with your torpedoes, not even saying what will happen if you are and put your Sub on AI control on the surface.

If you are close to the enemy sending a strike is like a 30s job…

[Jakob Knight]

1 hour ago, Yedwy said:

If you are close to the enemy sending a strike is like a 30s job…

 

If you are close to the enemy and surface to launch a plane, you won't have a Sub to return to, and your team will want to know why you didn't attack with your Sub instead of aircraft.  If you are not close, it will take upwards of one to two minutes to launch your planes, travel to the target (assuming your team is spotting for you), line up the attack, and complete the attack.  All while your Sub is either on the surface or burning dive time.

[Wolfswetpaws]

2 hours ago, Yedwy said:

If you are close to the enemy sending a strike is like a 30s job…

Suppose for a moment that the I-54 is on one side of an island and an opponent is on the opposite side of that island.
And suppose that the I-54 can remain stationary or at reduced speed while surfaced and decides to launch a squadron of planes.
Only some of the maps have islands big enough to prevent the I-54 from also being in range of a retaliatory air-strike-depth-charge attack.