WES_HoundDog Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 (edited) Experienced players have been saying it for a long time. They don't care about what we think or want. So much so to the point that it's said that they really only want new players that could care less about the game but are willing to fork over a bunch of cash before departure. Seems kind of questionable. Why wouldn't WG want loyal, long term knowledgeable customers? Well this Three kingdoms interation exposes why. So they can sell you a tier 9 tech tree ship (Iowa) with a special camo for nearly double what a premium tier 9 ship would go for. A ship that took almost no work to produce. They want their player base to be so stupid or naive that they don't even realize the absolute fleece that wargamming is selling to them. Edited June 21 by WES_HoundDog 8 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel_Allan_Clark Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 That's capitalism, right there... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfswetpaws Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 12 minutes ago, WES_HoundDog said: Experienced players have been saying it for a long time. They don't care about what we think or want. So much so to the point that it's said that they really only want new players that could care less about the game but are willing to fork over a bunch of cash before departure. Seems kind of questionable. Why wouldn't WG want loyal long term knowledgeable customers? Well this Three kingdoms interation exposes why. So they can sell you a tier 9 tech tree ship (Iowa) with a special camo for nearly double what a premium tier 9 ship would go for. A ship that took almost no work to produce. They want their player base to be so stupid they don't even realize the absolute fleece that wargamming is selling to them. If it is "stupid", but it works, then it's not stupid. 🙂 5 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunkCostFallacy Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 I suspect that there's more to it than that. I'm not saying that @WES_HoundDog is wrong ... there's definitely a strong motivation to make more money at work. But I also suspect that WG have found themselves in the position where they are better equipped to make cosmetic changes to the game than anything else. Putting it bluntly I think WG have been able to hire graphic artists much more readily than developers. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ensign Cthulhu Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 47 minutes ago, WES_HoundDog said: They want their player base to be so stupid or naive that they don't even realize the absolute fleece that wargamming is selling to them. You want to think that the player base is this stupid or naive because you want reasons to hate Wargaming. What if they know exactly what they're getting and decide that it's worth their hard-earned money? WHO ARE YOU TO TELL THEM OTHERWISE? 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mashed68 Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 They absolutely care about what you want. As long as you want to buy crates, play cv's, or play subs. Otherwise you don't matter, because they are laser focused on it. 1 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdmiralThunder Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 (edited) To be fair (and man do I hate to be fair to WG) it is NOT a T9 tech tree ship being sold. Yes, it is an Iowa clone with a silly Pan-Asia camo but it will be a T9 Premium ship which has way more value than a tech tree T9 ship. I mean Missouri is an Iowa class BB too. It is a bundle package as well that includes a lot of extra stuff... Bundle Deal - 36,366 Doubloons which includes: T9 Premium ship (normal cost 19,300 Doubloons) 10 pt Captain (normal cost 1500 Doubloons) 38X each of the 4 types of Blue Economic Boosts (Blues aren't sold for Doubloons normally but for the same # of Green Boosts it would be 15,200 Doubloons normal price so Blues would be way more) 108X each of 5 combat signals (these are not sold for real money so you have to do credit cost in armory and then figure what that many credits would cost in the shop = after all the number crunching it's about 19,750 Doubloons worth) 8,888,888 Credits (again crunching the #'s it's about 4000 Doubloons) Commemorative Flag (no way to assign value as they aren't sold individually - so whatever you think it's worth) +200% XP Combat Mission (whatever you think it is worth) Approx Doubloon individual value = 59,750 So, if you go by the individual Doubloon cost for these items you actually get a good deal if you buy the bundle. Now whether or not you agree with WG's values on things in the game is another issue. But, based on what the items sell for, you can sort of figure the bundles value with a little work (I did it very quick and loose but it isn't crazy far off). I wouldn't spend that much on it but based on what WG asks for these items and what the bundle costs + includes it isn't that outrageous. Personally, I have no issue with them using a copy paste of a tech tree ship to sell a Premium in another nation. Especially when it is for one like Pan Asia which just won't have IRL ships to call on (or very few) that aren't from other countries (players of the game from that region of the world deserve content too). I mean there are only so many real ships and only so many designs to call on. To add new content, especially this late in the game's life, it will involve a lot of copy paste, designs and concepts, what if's, and flat out made up stuff. It's either that or we get no new content or 300 Fletcher clones all for the US. No offense intended OP. I just don't see the issue here. Edited June 21 by AdmiralThunder 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meatgrindr Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 I see a silly painted replicant ship or a goofball captain with a chopstick through it's man-bun, I simply move on. the other side of capitalism, so to speak. Because in capitalism, the buyer always calls the shots. Amazing concept. 9 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor3006 Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 I agree that if all Wargaming does is just redecorate a ship and sells it as a premium, the game is not damaged in any way. They make a few dollars, the people who want the content are happy, and those of us who don't care for it, can safely ignore it. It would be different if it were a premium Yamato with really good AA and radar, whose introduction to the game would change everything. But it isn't. Wargaming is a for profit business and if they think this stuff appeals to players, I say let them go for it. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Itwastuesday Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 11 hours ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said: That's capitalism, right there... 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verblonde Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 I'll cheerfully kick WG when they deserve it, but I don't really think this is one of those occasions: All the ships in question are basically just re-skins of existing non-game-breaking things with added premium economy (in those cases where the original wasn't a premium already). It's hardly the first time WG have done this (including prior to the split): I'm pretty sure I have almost double figures now of Myoko and Atago clones, for example. They've even said that these PA versions of other things will be balanced independently of their parents, in case nation-specific stuff (or its lack) mess things up. Sure, it's a bit lazy, but re-using existing assets is hardly unique to the gaming industry. (Full disclosure: I have the Agir clone, and the RN T9 BB clone, both from crates.) 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torino2dc Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 1. Value is relative, it's not my place to tell other people what to do with their money. 2. WG needs to keep the lights on somehow. The Pan-Asian tech tree clones likely have a high ratio of revenue vs. effort invested. 3. New players in high tiers are the reason veteran players' stats continuously climb. To torture a metaphor: one doesn't look a gift devstrike in the mouth. 14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfswetpaws Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 3 hours ago, Itwastuesday said: 🙂 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nevermore135 Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 18 hours ago, AdmiralThunder said: To be fair (and man do I hate to be fair to WG) it is NOT a T9 tech tree ship being sold. Yes, it is an Iowa clone with a silly Pan-Asia camo but it will be a T9 Premium ship which has way more value than a tech tree T9 ship. I mean Missouri is an Iowa class BB too. It is a bundle package as well that includes a lot of extra stuff... It’s technically not even an Iowa clone. Being a Pan-Asian ship, it has the standard battleship upgrade options, i.e. it lacks either of the artillery plotting room options (slot 3 and 6) and can mount ASM1 in slot 3. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WES_HoundDog Posted June 21 Author Share Posted June 21 (edited) 20 hours ago, AdmiralThunder said: I mean Missouri is an Iowa class BB too. The Missouri was unique because it was that one ship that could help you emensely in a credit crunch. And to not be completely lazy about it they improved main and secondary angles as well as gave it radar which was wholly unique on a bb at the time. I have the og Missouri, and no i didn't buy it. In fact i don't even remember how i got it. Was it coal? In any regard. Wargaming came out with the neutered Missouri not too long ago. I don't remember how they were "selling" that one but i do recall people none to happy about it. Did it have a double price tag? On to all the people talking about people spending money how they see fit. I don't care how people spend their money. I didn't say anything about that. I was simply insinuating how Wargamming is preying on new players. Edited June 21 by WES_HoundDog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdmiralThunder Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 (edited) 1 hour ago, WES_HoundDog said: The Missouri was unique because it was that one ship that could help you emensely in a credit crunch. And to not be completely lazy about it they improved main and secondary angles as well as gave it radar which was wholly unique on a bb at the time. I have the og Missouri, and no i didn't buy it. In fact i don't even remember how i got it. Was it coal? In any regard. Wargaming came out with the neutered Missouri not too long ago. I don't remember how they were "selling" that one but i do recall people none to happy about it. Did it have a double price tag? On to all the people talking about people spending money how they see fit. I don't care how people spend their money. I didn't say anything about that. I was simply insinuating how Wargamming is preying on new players. I was pointing out Missouri is an Iowa too. One that is a Premium with some different aspects, including the built in credit printing press on the OG one and better forward armor (internal), but an Iowa none the less. The new Pan-Asian BB is also a Premium Iowa. It will be different than Iowa because Iowa is a tech tree ship. So, it isn't really accurate to say WG is selling you a tech tree Iowa. They aren't. They are selling a Premium version of Iowa (under a different nation). Missouri has a 1 degree better forward firing arc of the main guns compared to Iowa (31d vs 32d). The rear arc is the same on both ships (38d). That is inconsequential. The secondary guns on Missouri do have vastly improved firing arcs over Iowa (16d/15d vs 30d/34d) but it matters little. Secondary guns on 99% of US BB's, and that includes Iowa and Missouri, are not much of a threat. Missouri may have the edge in secondary guns if a situation presented where they could actually be used but it is no great bonus over Iowa. We have lots of tech tree ships in game from IRL that have Premium class sister-ships in game. Just in BB's we have New York & Texas / KGV & DOY / Colorado, WV41, & WV44 / Mackensen & Prinz Eitel Friedrich / Gneisenau & Scharnhorst / Bismarck & Tirpitz / Queen Elizabeth & Warspite / Richelieu & Jean Bart / Vittorio Veneto, Roma, & Littorio. I am probably missing some too not to mention that is JUST BB's and doesn't take into account the other classes. So lots of tech tree + Premium versions of ships in game and they all vary to some degree from each other. As far as an Iowa being added to the Pan-Asian tree we also have precedent for that. Pan-Asia just does not have a long history of real steel ships to call on for its game nation. What it does have, that is historical and accurate, is a history of the countries that make it up in game buying ships from other nations. There are 17 tech tree ships in the Pan-Asia tree. Of those 17, 10 are real ships that served with other countries before being transferred to the country it is listed for in game. The T2 DD was originally ordered by China I believe it was but seized and used by Germany (so almost the reverse of the norm for Pan-Asia). The same applies to most of their Premiums. I have 6 Pan-Asian Premiums that are real steel and ships that served with one nation then were transferred to another. Many Pan-Asian Premiums are also the same as other nation tech tree ships; just fantasy/folklore models. The point here is it is not unusual for ships in Pan-Asia to be ships that served with other countries originally. They then are transferred to Asian countries, either IRL or as what if/fantasy, to serve there. There is nothing new or troublesome about this. If WG is going to add ships to the Pan-Asian tree (and they should for people from those regions IRL so they feel included) they have to draw on what history there is which is pretty much get ships from other countries or just make something up. I don't see how any of this is preying on new players? It is just how they have to add ships to that nation. Edited June 22 by AdmiralThunder 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USMC2145 Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 23 hours ago, WES_HoundDog said: Experienced players have been saying it for a long time. They don't care about what we think or want. So much so to the point that it's said that they really only want new players that could care less about the game but are willing to fork over a bunch of cash before departure. Seems kind of questionable. Why wouldn't WG want loyal, long term knowledgeable customers? Well this Three kingdoms interation exposes why. So they can sell you a tier 9 tech tree ship (Iowa) with a special camo for nearly double what a premium tier 9 ship would go for. A ship that took almost no work to produce. They want their player base to be so stupid or naive that they don't even realize the absolute fleece that wargamming is selling to them. I have seen this in other games. What WG has been doing of late tells me that they are hurting in the money department. This tells me that they are not getting very many new players to spend money on things, and that players who have been here have also cut back. This, in turn, tells me the company is not doing well. WG does not release earnings statements, so we really do not know the condition of the company, but we can take a guess based on what they do. Look how many different forms of currancy they have added over the last couple of years. Almost every patch has a new spend on this and that. The battle pass, early release ships, crates, tokens, etc. Many of the early release ships and premiums are nothing but cut-and-paste with a new paint job. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Slayer Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 2 hours ago, WES_HoundDog said: I have the og Missouri, and no i didn't buy it. In fact i don't even remember how i got it. Was it coal? The first Free XP, followed by Musashi and Nelson. Coal came later. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ensign Cthulhu Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 22 minutes ago, Lord_Slayer said: The first Free XP, followed by Musashi and Nelson. Coal came later. I seem to recall Nelson preceding Musashi, and Musashi being either for coal OR for FXP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clammboy Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 15 minutes ago, Ensign Cthulhu said: I seem to recall Nelson preceding Musashi, and Musashi being either for coal OR for FXP. Got the Masashi for 750 FXP I believe one of my better purchases. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ensign Cthulhu Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 1 hour ago, AdmiralThunder said: I don't see how any of this is preying on new players? Every cent of money WG makes is like a war crime to the OP. He ain't nothing but a hound dog, crying all the time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a252 Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 Weegee is smart, using centuries old story like three kingdoms and journey to the west to create contents. They don't have to worry with copyright if they don't look like they are copying from other franchise 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schnitchelkid01_ Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 (edited) 37 minutes ago, a252 said: Weegee is smart, using centuries old story like three kingdoms and journey to the west to create contents. They don't have to worry with copyright if they don't look like they are copying from other franchise I didn't think of it this way, it totally makes sense from a business side of things Edited June 22 by Schnitchelkid01_ 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
palestreamer Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 Perhaps they are trying to build their market in China and Asia. In which case Chinese themed ships is good marketing. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfswetpaws Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 2 minutes ago, palestreamer said: Perhaps they are trying to build their market in China and Asia. In which case Chinese themed ships is good marketing. Seems to work with people who have Asian heritage, no matter where they live, in my understanding. Which supports your "good marketing" assessment. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now