PQ Rage quits mid match on stream

[clammboy]

14 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

The reason I don't run "mods" is because they get "broken" every time the game updates, it seems.
So, my options become:
1.  run the game without mods
2.  wait for the mods to become updated and then play the game with working mods.

Sure, mods are only supposed to be allowed to provide information that one could already get by careful observation of the game. 
But, frankly, I'm not 100% convinced, or, I get the impression that playing with mods is playing in "easy mode" versus "hard-core mode".  The submarine ping-tracker mod, for example.
But, that's just a personal feeling.  So maybe it's just me.

 

Of course and maybe it’s just me but the sub ping marker is garbage. Most mods you don’t even use 10 games after you load them. To make a big deal out of them or call them easy mode seems like quite the stretch but that’s just me we all don’t agree on everything.

[SolitudeFreak]

11 minutes ago, OldSchoolGaming_Youtube said:

So, what were basically saying is: Ignore what you see ingame and instead rely on that navigator mod or minimap is saying?

Like I said, I play vanilla and just eyeball it. Without even reading the mod indicator, it just looked like a mid salvo to me. He did get some damage in, 11205 to be exact.

The minimap by default shows you a non-graduated angle against the ship you are actively targeting, and it does seem to show an angle at the fall of shot. I've never been great at minmap aiming though.

So yeah, when eyeballing it, it can be difficult to know what's going to happen, but to me, that cruiser, which is rather notorious with its armor setup, was turning in, and I wasn't surprised by those bounces.

[Wolfswetpaws]

19 minutes ago, OldSchoolGaming_Youtube said:

So, what were basically saying is: Ignore what you see ingame and instead rely on that navigator mod or minimap is saying?

Because I have a hard time looking at the picture above and NOT seeing a cruiser broadsiding, maybe not a perfect 90 degree broadside, but a broadside none the less.

If I was playing a cruiser and faced of a BB I WOULD NOT just rely on this lazy azz angeling .... and I would get dev struck if I did. But thats just this amazing game!

I think it is worth mentioning that ships steer from their aft.
The rudder pushes the aft to the port while the ship is in a turn to starboard.
This is the opposite of how a car steers.

With a ship's aft getting pushed to the port the hull will slightly move away from the impact site of the projectiles during the turn, and thus the projectiles may fall a tiny bit "short" (low) of their intended impact point upon a hull, or may even hit the water instead of the hull.

Sort of like a bull-fighter saying "Olé" and dancing out of the path of a charging bull, perhaps?

[Zysyss]

On 4/12/2024 at 12:45 AM, Unlooky said:

Pretty funny clip from the "best battleship player on the earth"

https://clips.twitch.tv/RacyAwkwardOryxYouDontSay-yeNeCulra4-bzFyS

How is he, as a CC, allowed to blatantly violate the game rules by doing this? 

Most of us good players feel the same way he does. Between the "I don't care, stats don't matter, it's only a game" baddies in high tier and the crap WG has been doing more and more, gameplay has become a joke and very frustrating to play. Good players are fleeing this game or have just stopped playing random and only playing clan battles and KoTs for a reason. With good players leaving, it is just making high-tier gameplay even worse. PQ is not the only streamer venting their frustration with the game on the live stream. I am sure it is starting to hurt WG's bottom line because there are players who watch streams and YouTube to see if they even want to play the game, and this makes them think twice about it. 

I logged on today and during the afternoon, which is on a Saturday patch week that used to have 17K+ players on and today only had a bit over 6K players on. Player numbers are dropping, and there is a reason they are dropping. 

 

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

28 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

I think it is worth mentioning that ships steer from their aft.
The rudder pushes the aft to the port while the ship is in a turn to starboard.
This is the opposite of how a car steers.

With a ship's aft getting pushed to the port the hull will slightly move away from the impact site of the projectiles during the turn, and thus the projectiles may fall a tiny bit "short" (low) of their intended impact point upon a hull, or may even hit the water instead of the hull.

Sort of like a bull-fighter saying "Olé" and dancing out of the path of a charging bull, perhaps?

Worth noting that ships in this game do NOT turn from the aft...I can't remember if it was LWM who talked about it, or iChase.

Either way, ships in game turn differently than on real life.

[Unlooky]

On 4/12/2024 at 12:55 AM, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

Submit the evidence in a ticket to WG.

Well they've received and closed it, but WG does not disclose punishments. 

I suppose we will have to wait and see if anything happens. 

[majmac]

1 hour ago, OldSchoolGaming_Youtube said:

So, what were basically saying is: Ignore what you see ingame and instead rely on that navigator mod or minimap is saying?

When I am shooting, I do glance at the mini-map to see the "angle of attack".

[clammboy]

4 hours ago, HogHammer said:

Isn't that the place with great Chocolate Dipped Cones?

Oh, wait...that's DQ.

DQ used to make really good cheeseburgers to I know you like them.

[3LUE]

56 minutes ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

Worth noting that ships in this game do NOT turn from the aft...I can't remember if it was LWM who talked about it, or iChase.

Either way, ships in game turn differently than on real life.

Ships turn on center not on aft. It is why you get so much ship slide when turning. Once you figure out how ships slide when turning works it makes hitting them in a turn easier. 

Edited April 13 by 3LUE

[iDuckman]

i know rhulk.  He's a decent young dude, and a damn fine BB main.  I imagine whatever is between him and PQ is along the lines of, "Who's the fastest gunslinger?"

[3LUE]

15 minutes ago, majmac said:

When I am shooting, I do glance at the mini-map to see the "angle of attack".

 

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

3 hours ago, Col_NASTY said:

Everything is viewed/interpreted in 1000 different ways of course.

I am look at fundamentals.

Sports.. even playing field. solid rules,  physical competitions.

Fom Ping Pong to Football.

Most Sports can be affected by injury , health weather etc.

For example.. A Sprinter with a sore baby toe can be the difference between a Gold Medal and a Bronze in the 100M

Equating that with an old man like me beating up kids from my house with a Mega dollar PC set-up hooked into 5 Gig Fiber.

I understand Esports..  That is a far away from WG as it can possible be. This is an Arcade game. Not me saying it.. it's the reason why is isn't even mentioned in the ESports world.

Even more.. Have you EVER seen a CPU/GPU or ANY serious reviewer use WOWS or any WG make used in any comparisons , Tests or demos?

I know this will trigger a few but I have been here for years, former whale and have thousands of games and almost every ship they make... I am not some newb who hasn't had time to form an opinion.

Been in Gaming since I had and hosted my OWN Quake server.

Not to sound like Al Bundy but on the Sports side I have more titles in 3 sports and Gold Medals than your average hasbeen. You can find me in California's Hall of Champions

I say that not to brag but to say this.  I know a little about what I am talking about.

 I hope all that drivel helps.

Ah. I think I see.

The reality of the game is that it's just a game, not a sport. I agree with this.

With that said, there are people who believe that the game is a sport erroneously.

That belief then informs their philosophy with respect to the game and their frame of mind when interacting with it.

We are therefore forced to confront folks who behave as though this is a sport when it is not.

We can ignore this or point out the truth...but unless they accept our position, we will make no headway.

[Jakob Knight]

6 hours ago, Col_NASTY said:

We ARE still talking about a VIDEOGAME.....

Right??

I dunno.  Can a 5-year old with lightning-quick reflexes jump into the WOWS with a Tier 10 Premium Cruiser and dominate everyone around them, or does their performance rely to a large extent on experience, knowledge of technique, and understanding of mechanics?  In many classic video games, quick reflexes trumped anything else as the primary trait needed to play them well.

 

So, if your definition of a 'video game' is something that doesn't require any particular degree of practice or effort to do well in, then I would say WOWS does not fit that definition, as I believe a very large part of how well you do in the game is going to be determined by the effort you put in to become skilled at it.  At the same time, I don't consider it a sport in the same way I don't consider Poker or Chess a sport.  A sport is a physical activity where physical capabilities are paramount rather than the intellectual, and a rookie can do amazingly well at sports.  A rookie at Poker or Chess is another story.

 

Rather, I would consider WOWS in the category of competitive gaming, where the players face off against other players (rather than 'the House' or some automated opposition) in a situation regulated and balanced for skill and experience-based outcomes rather than physical-based ones.  

 

As for my analogy, I realize it probably would escape those unable to cross-analyze between disciplines, so I will explain.  Those who seek physical shortcuts and amplifications in a physical sport are doing the same as those who seek gameplay modifications and hacks in a video game...they are both seeking ways to get around their own limited abilities and achieve a higher capability in their activities than they otherwise are capable of achieving through the normal expected conditions others in their field operate under.

 

 

Edited April 14 by Jakob Knight

[Wolfswetpaws]

12 hours ago, majmac said:

When I am shooting, I do glance at the mini-map to see the "angle of attack".

I do, here & there.
It's useful when playing, especially when determining the target's orientation and direction of movement.

[Wolfswetpaws]

13 hours ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

Worth noting that ships in this game do NOT turn from the aft...I can't remember if it was LWM who talked about it, or iChase.

Either way, ships in game turn differently than on real life.

If you could post a link to the material you're referencing, that'd be great.  🙂 

 

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

26 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

If you could post a link to the material you're referencing, that'd be great.  🙂 

 

It was on the old forums...

[Jakob Knight]

13 hours ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

Worth noting that ships in this game do NOT turn from the aft...I can't remember if it was LWM who talked about it, or iChase.

Either way, ships in game turn differently than on real life.

 

In real life, each ship has a 'pivot point' which the ship will turn around when the helm is altered.  This isn't the same for all ships and depends on how the mass is distributed and other hydrodynamic factors.  It also isn't in the exact center of the gravity for the ship, but Officers of the Deck have to learn where this is during their qualifications for obvious reasons.

[Wolfswetpaws]

8 minutes ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

It was on the old forums...

I like LWM and respect her talents.
That said, some things can be found in places other than her writings.  🙂 

https://knowledgeofsea.com/turning/

https://www.marineinsight.com/naval-architecture/rudder-ship-turning/
 

Edited April 14 by Wolfswetpaws

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

15 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

I like LWM and respect her talents.
That said, some things can be found in places other than her writings.  🙂 

https://knowledgeofsea.com/turning/

https://www.marineinsight.com/naval-architecture/rudder-ship-turning/
 

Yes, I agree. Your notes on how ships turn in real life are correct.

My point is that WG does not model turning as it happens in real life.

I'm still searching to see if I can find it. Unfortunately, I haven't been successful yet.

[HogHammer]

1 hour ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

Yes, I agree. Your notes on how ships turn in real life are correct.

My point is that WG does not model turning as it happens in real life.

I'm still searching to see if I can find it. Unfortunately, I haven't been successful yet.

I looked in WoW's wiki and could not find an answer. However, @iDuckman may have a little better insight on this or perhaps direct us in the right direction for a definitive answer. 

[iDuckman]

3 hours ago, HogHammer said:

I looked in WoW's wiki and could not find an answer. However, @iDuckman may have a little better insight on this or perhaps direct us in the right direction for a definitive answer. 

No, it's not in the wiki.  Ships do skid and that's modeled somewhat in game,  You can see it especially with destroyers.

I don't believe you can say that they turn at the center (something I saw above).  Think of a car with rear wheel steering.  The turn center is at the front wheels, but cars don't skid. (And the suspensions are set up to seriously limit roll - something you can't do on a ship.**)  So maybe the turn center is ahead of the bow?

One of the best illustrations I've seen of the difference between a boat and a ship involves how they turn.  A boat rolls into the turn; a ship rolls out.  There's a video that you could look for.

As to whether WoWs truly models how a ship turns, I don't think they capture the full roll effect, but I'd want more evidence on the skidding and turn center before I agree.

 

** Technically a deep keel, like on a sailboat, is anti-roll.  So maybe all the keels on New Jersey (there are five) help some, but they're mostly to direct water flow.

Edited April 14 by iDuckman

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

We could just load up a British light cruisers and watch it in a full speed turn...

If the aft kicks out rather than just turns, we know it's not modeled as though the aft mounted rudder is initiating the turn...

[iDuckman]

2 hours ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

We could just load up a British light cruisers and watch it in a full speed turn...

If the aft kicks out rather than just turns, we know it's not modeled as though the aft mounted rudder is initiating the turn...

So you think WoWs is turning from the center rather than the rudders?  Yeah that should be easy enough to see.  But then the skid would have to be "faked". 

LWM has LOTS of experience with turning.  @LittleWhiteMouse What do you think?

 

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

4 minutes ago, iDuckman said:

So you think WoWs is turning from the center rather than the rudders?  Yeah that should be easy enough to see.  But then the skid would have to be "faked". 

LWM has LOTS of experience with turning.  @LittleWhiteMouse What do you think?

 

Not necessarily faked...just less visible than it would be in real life.

In real life, the skid is the bow being dragged around to make the circle that is initiated by the aft. The greater the distance of the bow from the rudder, the greater the 'skid'.

If the ship turns from the middle, the bow is still some distance from the middle of the ship, and a skid is visible.

The difference is that BOTH the bow AND stern will skid...which is what I think is visible when watching cruisers turn.

[Admiral_Karasu]

Hmm.. whenever a ship turns, say turns to port, the stern will swing to starboard, I think the pivoting point is midships.  For this reason, as it is now the night of April 15th, Chief Officer Murdoch ordered a port-around to be executed in order to avoid the Titanic colliding with the iceberg. Just by turning to port would have slammed the Titanic's stern from a about midships to back straight into the berg.