BOBTHEBALL Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 15 hours ago, Navalpride33 said: WR% is a trophy stat. Not an indicator of anything else... WR indicates how good you are at winning in-game. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrewbassg Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 3 hours ago, HogHammer said: (2) From a post "venting" about one's frustration, the thread has digressed somewhat into player stats (who's right or wrong in defining), views of overpowered ships, WG being untrustworthy, and some chest-thumping. It's not direct personal attacks yet, but it's darn close to it. I would say... A bit more seriously ... people don't like to be "shown their place". Its a nasty thing to do. Quite a few people think, that their stats warrant something else than, lets say, respect . Like dictating terms of discussions, refusing to acknowledge legitimate and valid points and alike. And this don't go well with a lot of folks, me included. Don't show my place, I will make my place as I see fit and as I can. As for stats.... I don't care about them. I see a ship in battle and what that ship does. That's the only metric I care about. Besides ...... there is nothing better in "bait da monke" game, then lowly stats 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOBTHEBALL Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 19 minutes ago, Andrewbassg said: Quite a few people think, that their stats warrant something else than, lets say, respect . Like dictating terms of discussions, refusing to acknowledge legitimate and valid points and alike. I mean if I had to get advice from someone on this game. I'd rather get it from someone with good stats who know what they're talking about. Incredibly skilled with the ship or topic they're discussing instead of getting it with someone with bad stats. I think this is a sort of different thing and that we can all agree on this. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfswetpaws Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 2 hours ago, BOBTHEBALL said: WR indicates how good you are at winning in-game. Yes, with a specific group of 23 other players at a moment in time. The players in a random battle are selected by the matchmaker program from whoever is available at the time. The Loss Rate is the opposite, of course, but also is a snapshot of a moment in time and the teams that played. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfswetpaws Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 2 hours ago, Andrewbassg said: I see a ship in battle and what that ship does. That's the only metric I care about. This. ^^^^ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOBTHEBALL Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 41 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said: Yes, with a specific group of 23 other players at a moment in time. I'd rather take advice and learn from someone with a 57% WR compared to someone with a 47% WR 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navalpride33 Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 3 hours ago, BOBTHEBALL said: WR indicates how good you are at winning in-game. Knowing how WR% can be manipulated. Its no secrete, and there's documentation on how to do so. Not to mention, there's documentation of high WR% players in DIV, tanking everyone's WR on purpose... I have a hard time with distorted statements by people with so much innocence/bliss on the topic. Who, probably, dont know their WR% is being tanked by others. So lets celebrate your innocence together.. I'll be here I promise to see you mature on the topic. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOBTHEBALL Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 8 minutes ago, Navalpride33 said: Knowing how WR% can be manipulated. Its no secrete, and there's documentation on how to do so. Instead of "Celebrating my innocence" (Kinda weird and really creepy) tell me how it's manipulated. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navalpride33 Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 (edited) 17 minutes ago, BOBTHEBALL said: Instead of "Celebrating my innocence" (Kinda weird and really creepy) tell me how it's manipulated. Its already written down in past post in the thread... Here, video documentation from Mighty Jingles. -------------------------------- Sorry if you misinterpret the the word innocence... You're from Asia and maybe I have to be more direct with you... On this topic of WR... You have shown to be on the side of the naive, gullible, trusting blindly stage. Based on your post. Sometimes in those situations... You have to let the person come around on their own. Thats why I stated, I'll be here when you come to your senses on the topic. Now, after being told you statement on WR is incorrect and you still want to stick to your guns. Its on you.. Edited April 3 by Navalpride33 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOBTHEBALL Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 58 minutes ago, Navalpride33 said: Its already written down in past post in the thread... Until you share the documentation with me, I'm just going to assume you're the average player not wanting to improve and instead whining about how the game is biased, you don't need skill and how WG is out to get you. 59 minutes ago, Navalpride33 said: Here, video documentation from Mighty Jingles. Good on the guy for winning, I totally watched it all and didn't skip through it at all. 1 hour ago, Navalpride33 said: You're from Asia and maybe I have to be more direct with you... I'm not going to comment on this 1 hour ago, Navalpride33 said: On this topic of WR... You have shown to be on the side of the naive, gullible, trusting blindly stage. Based on your post. On the topic of WR, from what you say. I'll repeat what I said. Someone who is around average, frustrated with the game after being clubbed a couple games and decides it's not their own fault for bad plays. 1 hour ago, Navalpride33 said: Sometimes in those situations... You have to let the person come around on their own. Thats why I stated, I'll be here when you come to your senses on the topic. I'll be here when you accept you're the problem 1 hour ago, Navalpride33 said: Now, after being told you statement on WR is incorrect and you still want to stick to your guns. Its on you.. I know I'm right and you're just frustrated with the game and the bad decisions you make in battle. That's ok we're all here to help you improve and learn from your mistakes. We all have bad games/sessions and it's totally fine to want to vent out those frustrations. Hope you stick around lol - Boob 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral_Karasu Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 8 hours ago, BOBTHEBALL said: Because when the bad players "try" to influence the match they die and lose. Yes... could be, but why on just one team, not the other one... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frostbow Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 (edited) Thread Title: What's wrong with players? Answer: On 4/2/2024 at 4:29 PM, Navalpride33 said: Skills do not get you a Kraken.. Begging does... Now, begging is an art skill in WOWS. Such a bullsh*t answer. Edited April 3 by Frostbow 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verytis Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 1 hour ago, Admiral_Karasu said: Yes... could be, but why on just one team, not the other one... Chances are they don't know the right way to attempt influencing the match, aka lack of knowledge or tactical awareness When to push, pull or stall a flank When to relocate your ship from 1 flank to another When to reveal your position Overmatch, DPM, concealment values of you and your opponents However there's also a "micro" element that determines what actions one can pull off and survive. Situational awareness Dodging shells Targetting specific parts on a ship Predicting target movements It takes both of these elements to make a strong player. But the most crucial part is recognising mistakes by both you and your opponents. This is especially obvious in bronze rank where most opponents constantly make a series of mistakes for you to exploit sequentially. I'm sure there are entire clans of such players out there, many better than me. They're just not shamelessly bragging about their early season "sealclubbing". (Also cossack is just broken) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kruzenstern Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 16 hours ago, Asym said: So, to answer what I bolded in your thread: ask yourself the question: if a player simply plays in a Barney level division of three, how much of that is skill versus, just being there and not contributing as much of the others for the wins??? How many good players would take a freeloader along in their divisions to pad his winrate without contribution? I don't know any. Players usually division up with other players of similar skill. Plus a player like that is easily discernible by having bad Personal Rating. Of course, divisions will hugely improve (or wreck) ones stats. I am a prime example, my division winrates from back when I was still doing PvP are vastly better than my solo winrate. That is simply because having three people for certain on your team who can tell their behind from their head has a huge impact on your teams chances to win. Huge as in 3 50-55% solo players will get 65+% in 3 man divisions. Also my solo winrate is likely deflated, as most of my solo matches were for hunting combat missions and or dockyard tasks, and I didn't really play to win but to get most fires/spottings/whatever. Winrate IS a decent indicator (not measure, yes, that was correctly pointed out) of a players skill level. As with anything else, it has to be seen in context, like the meaningful WR is the recent one, and the one on the ship/class/tier in question. Global winrate can indeed be manipulated too easily, at least upward. I am fairly certain that in the 40% vs 60% match, the 40%er team will lose almost every match. Not because all the 60%ers are guaranteed good players (though most will be) but because all the 40%ers will be terrible (assuming players with 1000+ battles). Also divisions of good players having much higher winrates (and those of terribads having much lower) kinda proves both that there is skill in WOWS and that is does affect winrate. 17 hours ago, Asym said: Win Rate and Skill are apples and oranges.... You can actually have an above average win rate and do very little to enable those wins ! And again, the method of people with no good arguments. Citing exceptions to debase rules. But as long as it makes you feel better, please keep on clinging to being wrong. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfswetpaws Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 8 hours ago, BOBTHEBALL said: I'd rather take advice and learn from someone with a 57% WR compared to someone with a 47% WR And I'm merely somewhere between those numbers, eh? https://na.wows-numbers.com/player/1031789485,Wolfswetpaws/ Quote Win rate 50.63% Average I used to have a 47% win-rate, though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral_Karasu Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 I'm still slightly puzzled whether WR is important or not. My follow up question would be are there any plans for WG to start selling WR booster bundles? 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OT2_2 Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 1 minute ago, Admiral_Karasu said: I'm still slightly puzzled whether WR is important or not. My follow up question would be are there any plans for WG to start selling WR booster bundles? Honestly, it wouldn't astonish me at all since it certainly would be big business. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin_Simpleton Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 I wish I could get the stats on kill rates of ship types. I imagine I've killed many more DDs and subs than BBs playing BBs. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfswetpaws Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 3 minutes ago, Admiral_Karasu said: I'm still slightly puzzled whether WR is important or not. My follow up question would be are there any plans for WG to start selling WR booster bundles? If such "economic boosts" actually worked? Well, then I suppose WG/WOWs might market them. Random teams filled with random players, even talented players, are not as effective as a consistent team of players who've trained together, properly, for a long time. While it may not be statistical evidence, I'd like to use the movie "Miracle On Ice" to illustrate the concept. https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0082754/ Gathering observations of other team's play methods and other "intel data", are full-time jobs performed by some people for the benefit of serious sports teams nowadays. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfswetpaws Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 1 minute ago, Justin_Simpleton said: I wish I could get the stats on kill rates of ship types. I imagine I've killed many more DDs and subs than BBs playing BBs. https://na.wows-numbers.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin_Simpleton Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 @Wolfswetpaws, those stats don't show what I'm looking for. It doesn't say what type ships I have sunk with the ship I played. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral_Karasu Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 7 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said: If such "economic boosts" actually worked? Well, then I suppose WG/WOWs might market them. Random teams filled with random players, even talented players, are not as effective as a consistent team of players who've trained together, properly, for a long time. While it may not be statistical evidence, I'd like to use the movie "Miracle On Ice" to illustrate the concept. https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0082754/ Gathering observations of other team's play methods and other "intel data", are full-time jobs performed by some people for the benefit of serious sports teams nowadays. I have a better idea. Steal their skates the night before. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfswetpaws Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 20 minutes ago, Justin_Simpleton said: @Wolfswetpaws, those stats don't show what I'm looking for. It doesn't say what type ships I have sunk with the ship I played. Sorry @Justin_Simpleton. I had the link in my speed-dial and was hoping it would help. There was a topic recently with a newer stats website. I wonder if it can provide the answer you're seeking? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfswetpaws Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 22 minutes ago, Admiral_Karasu said: I have a better idea. Steal their skates the night before. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asym Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 19 hours ago, Andrewbassg said: This. Also we need to keep in mind that Wows median isn't 50. IRC is under 49. Yep. But here's the conundrum, there is no metric in wows that could do that. For example pot dmg can be easily attributed to using sec. So is being spotted and for how long. Spotting dmg, with cv;s around, is pretty meaningless. And how we account for unorthodox tactics, like '"keep'em busy"? 🙂 Also, for target selection.... I don't disagree but...... Games are played on computers that analyzes "everything you actually do" nanosecond by picosecond. Ever see a BOT do the "Fabuki Dance" weighing 98,000 tons !!! Yep, the computer "saw" your reticle and acted to avoid, 1.8 seconds faster than any human ever could have.... The Battlespace engine and servers track all sorts of CE data.... Algorithms can deduce what you were shooting at and the effectivity of those actions.... We could track a great deal in this game's version of CE.......because, we'd be looking at what "you do" not the outcomes cause by others... Combat power is easy to calculate. Density of effort as well. Cause ans Effect outcomes can be ranked for efficiency.... Map locations of efforts calculate "what effective positioning" results are...... It would be a simplistic CE but, we are playing on computers that render the data to accomplish the "revenue goals" for good or ill......but, they see it all..... It'd be better than what we have........which, is a arcade number. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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