Recruiting Station Event - Are all New Players PVP???

[Asym]

Oh-Kay, just opened the game this AM and started to look through the new Combat events and......saw this:

Kind of a neat idea to incentivize working with new players in Divisions...................Randoms only. Tiers V-X,*.     Almost snorted my coffee.......

Now, I might just be an old, broken down Horse Soldier but, wouldn't it be really a better idea to have two choices:  Randoms and COOP.....???  Cause, I would never division with a new player in Randoms......which, after the first week of "toxicity" and massive one sided Stomps, chases those players away very quickly.....  (I was one of those new players and it drove me very quickly into PVE...)  Now, I know why I don't refer this game or recruit.....  We, PVE Mains, aren't welcome........   BTW, last I talked to our PVE Whales, a dollar spent in PVE play is a Dollar spent in the game>?

And, considering there are as many PVE mains as PVP mains, in fact, whole clans of PVE mains that recruit new players, don't ya think both sides of this game should be represented....???

What are your thoughts !     

[Type_93]

The game is focus towards the PVP side. I’d be more than willing to Div up with new players and show them rope in randoms. I think it’s much easier to start off in PVP and be able to transition into PVE than vise versa. Someone who starts off in randoms is going to learn to play the game as it is. They won’t have the handicap of being set in their ways and having to adjust to Subs, CVs and the general craziness of randoms. They may start on Subs and really enjoy them. Once a new player gets comfortable in random play, co-op will be only an after thought. But if a new play starts in randoms and hates it, the transition to co-op with be smooth and they will have a hand up on players who only ever played pve. 

Edited February 8 by Type_93

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

7 minutes ago, Type_93 said:

Once a new player gets comfortable in random play, co-op will be only an after thought.

Very much not true.

I used to be PVP most of the time....was quite comfortable with it.

I've been transitioning to mostly PVE, as it's just a better experience.

[HogHammer]

30 minutes ago, Asym said:

Kind of a neat idea to incentivize working with new players in Divisions

This is a good idea, Asym.  But let me add this.  From one perspective, WoWs consider a "new" player one with less than 200 battles - affording them protected matchmaking.  I tend to believe the community, however, generally views new (newer) players as those with less than 1,000 battles.

Looking at the WoWs Missions, the Recruiting Station requires ships of Tier V-X.  Honestly, I do have issues with this.  To me, this is encouraging new players to purchase and/or grind up as fast as possible to get into this tier range.  Is a new player ready to play these tiers - absolutely not!  Are newer players ready (200 to 1,000 battles)? Not really, but I like the encouragement as a mission to include a "mentor" type mission to get these players a helping hand.

As far as PvP vs. PvE.  I encourage new players (<200 battles) always to do PvP from T1 to T4.  Why?  The new player server combines NA, EU, and Asia at that level.  Even with three regions represented, I have never seen more than a 3-3 real player/bot combination.  Probably 75 percent of the time, new players will only see one real person on the red team, while the rest are bots.  Really, this is as close to PvE matches as possible, with at least a taste of real battles against real people.  At least in this mode of play, advancing these players to the mission you describe makes a little more sense with the assistance of a mentor.

I will also add this.  The choice between PvP and PvE is an individual choice.  However, here, I still encourage random battles until they make that choice.  Because of the overall play style, I find it is much easier for players to transition from PvP to PvE than PvE to PvP.  This is not a knock against PvE players, but many carry "habits" early on into PvP that do not help them or contribute to this style of play.

From personal observation and experience, WoWs does a terrible job preparing new players for competitive play.  I would love to see the opportunity for new players to have access to the "training room" - they do not until they reach the final level (Level 17).  I would love to see WoWs create/allow special "training" clans (that meet a certain requirement) dedicated to training these new players with mentor training accounts (kind of like the current press accounts) populated with all T1 to T4 ships.  

I could go on and on...but I don't want to create a total wall of text.

[Frostbow]

1 hour ago, Type_93 said:

Once a new player gets comfortable in random play, co-op will be only an after thought.

Unlikely, especially if the player is conscious of the rewards earned/snowflakes dusted off/dockyard or combat missions accomplished per amount of time spent in the game. I have seen super unicums go to Co-op to finish missions simply because it is more time efficient compared to doing it in Random Battles. In my case, I can easily transition from PVP to PVE and back again. Co-op, brainless as it can be for some, still has its uses.

[Ensign Cthulhu]

@Asym;

Bear in mind that a "shipmate" might have been one who was recruited quite some time ago, when this system first started - and that for all we know, said "shipmate" is a unicum in more than one type and more than capable of holding their own at any tier.

My only "shipmate" is a player who wanted back in after a long time away, decided to restart with a new account, and asked me (on the old forums) to recruit him. For a little while, I used to get random injections of doubloons whenever he bought a ship. 

[Itwastuesday]

The idea is to get players In the queue. 

[Ensign Cthulhu]

9 minutes ago, Itwastuesday said:

The idea is to get players In the queue. 

Of course it is!

What do you expect them to do? Wave their hands and say "Hey everyone! Go outside and touch grass for a month"? 😂

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

9 minutes ago, Ensign Cthulhu said:

Of course it is!

What do you expect them to do? Wave their hands and say "Hey everyone! Go outside and touch grass for a month"? 😂

Indeed.

[Justin_Simpleton]

Maybe I should revive my alt account or make a new one.

[Aethervox]

2 hours ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

mostly PVE, as it's just a better experience.

ROFL. PVE is a 'kindergarten' experience. IMO, far too easy & boring. It is the 'kiddie' mode.

[Asym]

3 hours ago, Type_93 said:

The game is focus towards the PVP side. I’d be more than willing to Div up with new players and show them rope in randoms. I think it’s much easier to start off in PVP and be able to transition into PVE than vise versa. Someone who starts off in randoms is going to learn to play the game as it is. They won’t have the handicap of being set in their ways and having to adjust to Subs, CVs and the general craziness of randoms. They may start on Subs and really enjoy them. Once a new player gets comfortable in random play, co-op will be only an after thought. But if a new play starts in randoms and hates it, the transition to co-op with be smooth and they will have a hand up on players who only ever played pve. 

My point is that there should be Two Options under this plan ^^^:  Randoms and COOP.  As I said, Randoms are not noob friendly at all and it is smarter to have alternative paths that don't drive new players out of the game at the beginning....

 

[Asym]

2 hours ago, HogHammer said:

This is a good idea, Asym.  But let me add this.  From one perspective, WoWs consider a "new" player one with less than 200 battles - affording them protected matchmaking.  I tend to believe the community, however, generally views new (newer) players as those with less than 1,000 battles.

Looking at the WoWs Missions, the Recruiting Station requires ships of Tier V-X.  Honestly, I do have issues with this.  To me, this is encouraging new players to purchase and/or grind up as fast as possible to get into this tier range.  Is a new player ready to play these tiers - absolutely not!  Are newer players ready (200 to 1,000 battles)? Not really, but I like the encouragement as a mission to include a "mentor" type mission to get these players a helping hand.

As far as PvP vs. PvE.  I encourage new players (<200 battles) always to do PvP from T1 to T4.  Why?  The new player server combines NA, EU, and Asia at that level.  Even with three regions represented, I have never seen more than a 3-3 real player/bot combination.  Probably 75 percent of the time, new players will only see one real person on the red team, while the rest are bots.  Really, this is as close to PvE matches as possible, with at least a taste of real battles against real people.  At least in this mode of play, advancing these players to the mission you describe makes a little more sense with the assistance of a mentor.

I will also add this.  The choice between PvP and PvE is an individual choice.  However, here, I still encourage random battles until they make that choice.  Because of the overall play style, I find it is much easier for players to transition from PvP to PvE than PvE to PvP.  This is not a knock against PvE players, but many carry "habits" early on into PvP that do not help them or contribute to this style of play.

From personal observation and experience, WoWs does a terrible job preparing new players for competitive play.  I would love to see the opportunity for new players to have access to the "training room" - they do not until they reach the final level (Level 17).  I would love to see WoWs create/allow special "training" clans (that meet a certain requirement) dedicated to training these new players with mentor training accounts (kind of like the current press accounts) populated with all T1 to T4 ships.  

I could go on and on...but I don't want to create a total wall of text.

Gosh, we just disagree.  The gaming community isn't "just PVP"....  I am not PVP; nor, are a great many others in this game.  That doesn't mean we are incapable of playing Randoms, or Ranked, or Clan Battles.....  It means we dislike the "PVP culture..." of toxic behaviors and bravado in a game designed for 8 year olds.... 

So, if I were to recruit someone, I'd have to take them into Randoms to...........get massacred.  I get massacred everytime I accidentally find myself (once or twice a year !) in a Random battle (and, usually I am in the top three at end....) 

That's all I am saying:  Add a COOP choice and let COOP players recruit COOP players !  Our money is the same, yes?

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

14 minutes ago, Aethervox said:

ROFL. PVE is a 'kindergarten' experience. IMO, far too easy & boring. It is the 'kiddie' mode.

...as if PVP isn't easy and boring...

[Aethervox]

Just now, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

...as if PVP isn't easy and boring...

Nice try to be contrarian & obfuscate. The more accurate description for PVP would be 'frustrating' with all the sub par dreck players there these days.

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

8 minutes ago, Aethervox said:

Nice try to be contrarian & obfuscate. The more accurate description for PVP would be 'frustrating' with all the sub par dreck players there these days.

No.

More that PVP tiers 2-5 are generally easier than PVE Ops and PVE Asymmetric.

Tier 10 PVP with certain ships is easier than PVE Asymmetric.

[Aethervox]

2 minutes ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

More that PVP tiers 2-5 are generally easier

Enemy human players in these tiers may make the battle difficult. Also, PVP/random T2 - T5 tiers are often full of Bots which makes them rather like PVE/co-op. There can be very entertaining  PVP/random battles in T2 - T5 when the majority or all the players are human (which can happen still).

[clammboy]

2 hours ago, Frostbow said:

I have seen super unicums go to Co-op to finish missions simply because it is more time efficient compared to doing it in Random Battles.

Also almost guaranteed wins which helps a lot to speed up some missions.

Edited February 8 by clammboy

[Aethervox]

Three player divisions. Yes, sign me up. Invite me, please. Add Aethervoxx to your EU contacts & Antean to NA contacts.

As to divisioning with 2 new players, well, if they take the invite, sure, tho I doubt they will (& some of these divisions would be painful).

[Aethervox]

2 hours ago, HogHammer said:

As far as PvP vs. PvE.  I encourage new players (<200 battles) always to do PvP from T1 to T4.  Why?  The new player server combines NA, EU, and Asia at that level. 

I didn't know that the new player server was an amalgam of the three regional servers. Yes, I, 100% agree new players should grind thru T1 - T4 doing PVP.

[clammboy]

3 hours ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

I've been transitioning to mostly PVE, as it's just a better experience.

I wish they had something in between the two with Co-Op being to easy and PVP to frustrating or hard for some people.

Maybe if Co-op was 6 bots and 6 real players every game it would make the mode a little more challenging for co-op players and a little easier and less toxic for PVP folks. 

Or even just make it a new mode a bridge between the two.

 

[Ensign Cthulhu]

17 minutes ago, clammboy said:

Also almost guaranteed wins which helps a lot to speed up some missions.

I did almost all of the Michelangelo dockyard in Co-op. The only exceptions were the big ship XP and commander XP tasks; I used blue ship XP and red commander XP boosts in Randoms +/- Ranked for those. Since I spend almost all my time among the bots, just killing and chilling, I can stand the brief, intense periods of PVP needed to get those things done. I still don't want to make a regular thing of it. 

[ArIskandir]

8 minutes ago, clammboy said:

I wish they had something in between the two with Co-Op being to easy and PVP to frustrating or hard for some people.

Well, there's Operations Master Clamm... those are a bit more challenging than Co-op. But yeah, I also wish there would be some hybrid PvP/PvE mode, something like the Key Battles would be interesting.

 

Edit: and I was forgetting about Asymmetric, that was a lot of fun too.

Edited February 8 by ArIskandir

[HogHammer]

22 minutes ago, Asym said:

Gosh, we just disagree.  The gaming community isn't "just PVP"

I never said that anywhere in my overall agreement with you and said I do, in fact, have an issue with the mission you described.

 

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

41 minutes ago, Aethervox said:

Enemy human players in these tiers may make the battle difficult. Also, PVP/random T2 - T5 tiers are often full of Bots which makes them rather like PVE/co-op. There can be very entertaining  PVP/random battles in T2 - T5 when the majority or all the players are human (which can happen still).

Even all human teams at tier 5 are easier than PVE OPS and Asymmetric...the player skill at tier 5 is VERY low.