Santa left a bag of flaming dog turd on my doorstep!!

[Sailor_Moon]

3 hours ago, Crokodone said:

California has the highest sigma for us guns at t7 with spectacular HE for all occasions; the only problem for her is the position of the enemy.

Incorrect.

Colorado beats her at 2.0 sigma (with higher overmatch capabilities and only a 30s reload to boot!)

Also, 5k HE is ANYTHING  but "spectacular". I would never use that word ever to describe California's HE. EVER. She doesn't get improved HE damage, or high fire chance, or even improved HE penetration.

Now, if you were talking about KGV's HE, or Nelson's HE, sure, they've got great HE. Even Duke of York has improved HE damage (6,100). Heck, even Hyuga's HE is better, actually (damage-wise at 5700, although her fire chance IS admittedly a bit lower at 25% to California's 30%. Still, 700 more HE alpha is high. That's 14% more HE alpha damage(!)).

Edited January 3 by Sailor_Moon

[Sailor_Moon]

18 hours ago, Wrath_of_Deadguy said:

Then, just to rub salt in the wound, along comes WV '44 at last... with improved acceleration, better energy retention in turns, a sane main battery reload (and 406mm overmatch), faster turret traverse, buffed secondaries, and DFAA, making her a better Co-op pick in pretty much every single aspect.

Yep! Yep......yep. Salt rubbed in successfully. You're not wrong, either. Nope, not wrong....

^{Oh, don't mind me, just.....bashing my head against an excavator for a bit....*cries*}

[invicta2012]

33 minutes ago, Capt_Kremenski said:

I also have Jurua, got that from a veteran recruitment container, it's a UK destroyer (Gallant) that was transferred to the Brazilian navy so you have the ability to single fire torps. Not only does it look great I've had some good results with this.

Jurua is more of an H-class than anything else, she has that angled bridge introduced on HMS Hero and HMS Hereward and seen in game on Icarus. Historically she's as ordered by the Brazilian Navy before she was requisitioned by the British and turned into HMS Handy, and then HMS Harvester (an ASW destroyer). 

In terms of her playstyle, equipment, though, she is closer to Gallant than any of the later RN DDs like Icarus or Acasta. That sneaky combo of low detection and speed boost makes her a powerful torp sniper.

[mashed68]

17 minutes ago, invicta2012 said:

I wish I could say I liked any of the US Tier VII BBs but they are all wrong un's in one way or another. Port queens the lot them.

Blasphemy. 

[Wrath_of_Deadguy]

3 hours ago, Sailor_Moon said:

Heck, even Hyuga's HE is better, actually (damage-wise at 5700, although her fire chance IS admittedly a bit lower at 25% to California's 30%. Still, 700 more HE alpha is high. That's 14% more HE alpha damage(!)).

Don't forget the MBRB!

...and the base reload that's more than five seconds shorter.

...and the extra 4+ knots of top speed.

[Volron]

Yeah!  Screw that gift horse!  It's trash!

 

Silliness aside, as I said it does mean you will not have to worry about them being pulled next time you do crates.  This increases your chance of getting a ship you do want.

[YouSatInGum]

On 1/1/2024 at 3:16 PM, Capt_Kremenski said:

Toulon - I can walk faster than this thing and while I'm at it go get a coffee while waiting for the guns to reload (28 seconds on a cruiser?? Did I read that right?).

 

Just so you know.  Toulon is very good when the mode is limited to same tier or lower.  The reason why is Toulon can overmatch every cruiser except Indy,NO, and yorck.  Last time T7 cruiser brawl was around....Toulon was top dog.

I had some very good games in it in ranked recently.

 

...now you didn't say how many crates you opened.... but it could be worse.... did you see my haul?  only got 1 pity drop ship.

 

[Kynami]

Not to mention the Toulon has both heals and speed boost... It may not have a ton of DPM, but it has very respectable burst on a platform with aggressive concealment. Getting to sneak up on people with its 10.1 conceal to use those 305mm on broadsides while cruising around at 37 knots speed. That isn't a weak ship by any means. Just not a ship that is appreciated by co-op mains looking for big DPM.

[Sailor_Moon]

4 hours ago, Wrath_of_Deadguy said:

Don't forget the MBRB!

...and the base reload that's more than five seconds shorter.

...and the extra 4+ knots of top speed.

Well noted! Yeah, I didn't even mention that. Oh, and Hyuga also gets 45s turret traverse....which is quite useful! and Ok main battery firing angles IIRC.

[Sailor_Moon]

3 hours ago, Volron said:

Yeah!  Screw that gift horse!  It's trash!

 

Silliness aside, as I said it does mean you will not have to worry about them being pulled next time you do crates.  This increases your chance of getting a ship you do want.

Oh yeah, listen, free premium ships are free premium ships. That's ALWAYS welcome 👍

[Capt_Kremenski]

17 hours ago, YouSatInGum said:

Just so you know.  Toulon is very good when the mode is limited to same tier or lower.  The reason why is Toulon can overmatch every cruiser except Indy,NO, and yorck.  Last time T7 cruiser brawl was around....Toulon was top dog.

I had some very good games in it in ranked recently.

 

...now you didn't say how many crates you opened.... but it could be worse.... did you see my haul?  only got 1 pity drop ship.

 

I opened maybe 1 or 2 mega, same with large (or whatever they were called) and 30 odd small - I used all my tokens buying smalls, basically  everything from the free BP and my paltry 150 ships. No dubs spent.

Played the Nottingham today for the first time, I know it's described by youtubers as one of the worst ships in game but I enjoyed it and had a decent(ish) battle

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

3 hours ago, Capt_Kremenski said:

I opened maybe 1 or 2 mega, same with large (or whatever they were called) and 30 odd small - I used all my tokens buying smalls, basically  everything from the free BP and my paltry 150 ships. No dubs spent.

Played the Nottingham today for the first time, I know it's described by youtubers as one of the worst ships in game but I enjoyed it and had a decent(ish) battle

Beware the first battle feeling.

Most new ships I get seem to have preferential RNG in the first battle...I suppose to help me feel good about the acquisition.

Get a number of battles under your belt before assessing a ship.

[Nevermore135]

On 1/3/2024 at 5:16 PM, invicta2012 said:

In terms of her playstyle, equipment, though, she is closer to Gallant than any of the later RN DDs like Icarus or Acasta. That sneaky combo of low detection and speed boost makes her a powerful torp sniper.

In terms of playstyle, Jurua is as close to Gallant as any ship can possibly be - she’s identical. WG implemented the former as a Pan-American clone of the latter.

Edited January 5 by Nevermore135

[Capt_Kremenski]

This is the replay of the Nottingham battle.

I'm only posting it because I noticed something I've never seen before - an enemy sub was firing deck guns at me!

Yep I'm sure you've all seen this but it was new (and funny) to me.

Just after I kill the Tirpitz I get pinged by the sub on our flank (who I thought was dead) - he then fires deck guns at me!!

 

https://replayswows.com/replay/192584#stats

[Gasboy]

California's not awesome, but not terrible either.

[Gasboy]

On 1/3/2024 at 5:16 PM, invicta2012 said:

Jurua is more of an H-class than anything else, she has that angled bridge introduced on HMS Hero and HMS Hereward and seen in game on Icarus. Historically she's as ordered by the Brazilian Navy before she was requisitioned by the British and turned into HMS Handy, and then HMS Harvester (an ASW destroyer). 

In terms of her playstyle, equipment, though, she is closer to Gallant than any of the later RN DDs like Icarus or Acasta. That sneaky combo of low detection and speed boost makes her a powerful torp sniper.

Except it's not based on the real HMS Harvester/ex-HMS Handy/Jurua, sadly.

[Helstrem]

Spent 5 more tokens last night on a Santa's Mega Gift container.  Got Toulon.  Statwise and armorwise she looks fine.  I haven't had a chance to take her out yet through.

[Sailor_Moon]

10 hours ago, Gasboy said:

California's not awesome, but not terrible either.

She's not awesome by any stretch of the imagination for double sure, and, well, she's certainly not COMPLETELY and utterly irredeemable, either, definitely not. But she's pretty darn terrible for her tier, unfortunately. 😔

So....yes but actually no 😛

[invicta2012]

13 hours ago, Gasboy said:

Except it's not based on the real HMS Harvester/ex-HMS Handy/Jurua, sadly.

 It's difficult to know what the original Brazilian design for their destroyers was - the same design was also exported to Argentina as the Buenos Aires class (PD image here: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:ARA_Buenos_Aires.jpg, which shows a different bridge to any of the RN DDs). That said, what we have - a G class hull (with the curved forecastle deck end, which is square on the I class), the post-H class bridge and the classic DD armament with four guns and the twin torpedo banks - is both close enough to Harvester as built and Jurua as ordered to be OK (IMHO). 

[Kruzenstern]

On 1/3/2024 at 11:06 PM, invicta2012 said:

I wish I could say I liked any of the US Tier VII BBs but they are all wrong un's in one way or another. Port queens the lot them.

I beg to differ. I thought the same, and then played the West Virigina '44 in asymmetrics just for lols, thinking she would be the same kind of turd as California, Colorado etc.

Oh boy was I wrong. I actually had never researched her and had no idea her secondaries were the good kind, and her main guns als seem more accurate than they should be. I am actually doing better in her than I am in my Massachusetts, and I am doing quite well in Massa. I think by now I have done some 10 asymmetric battles in WV and in 9 of them I have exceeded 200K damage. I think among my plethora of ships, only Schlieffen has been a more reliable performer in asymmetrics.

When asymmetrics are gone, I will try in in Operations and I suspect it will do quite well there too as a poor man's Massa.

 

On 1/4/2024 at 11:54 PM, Capt_Kremenski said:

opened maybe 1 or 2 mega, same with large (or whatever they were called) and 30 odd small - I used all my tokens buying smalls, basically  everything from the free BP and my paltry 150 ships. No dubs spent.

For that number of containers, your haul is actually pretty good. If you want ships, you need to get mega boxes, and small ones actually have the lowest ship chance. If you bought Satan boxes for roughly 127K dobloons (large number for statistics, scales down linearly), you could get either 135 Mega, 212 Big or 563 Small. With 16%/9%/2.5% ship chance and 15/27/100 mercy rule respectively, you would on average get 21-22 ships from the Megas, 19 from the Bigs and 14 from the Smalls. With guaranteed 9/7/5 from the mercy rule. And also looking at the other rewards, you get twice as many blue boosters in a drop from Mega than from big, with a chance to get red ones on top, while the Mega box costs less than twice as much as the big ones. Nevermind small one which also have shitty green boosters. If you have a choice, getting anything other than Mega Boxes is shooting yourself in the foot.

Edited January 7 by Kruzenstern

[Gasboy]

7 hours ago, invicta2012 said:

 It's difficult to know what the original Brazilian design for their destroyers was - the same design was also exported to Argentina as the Buenos Aires class (PD image here: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:ARA_Buenos_Aires.jpg, which shows a different bridge to any of the RN DDs). That said, what we have - a G class hull (with the curved forecastle deck end, which is square on the I class), the post-H class bridge and the classic DD armament with four guns and the twin torpedo banks - is both close enough to Harvester as built and Jurua as ordered to be OK (IMHO). 

Except in game it has one more gun than as built and an extra torpedo launcher.  The Brits were short on guns, so built her with 3 main battery, and one of the torpedo launchers had been removed to take on more aa/anti-submarine weaponry.  If she had not been sunk, this is likely how she would have been returned to Brazil.

And it is not difficult to know, this information is common enough that it's on Wikipedia, and referenced from several publications people can go and read through.  The RN would also certainly have records, which WG likely requested access to.  Brazil would also have it on record.  The wreck is also located...

[Nevermore135]

5 hours ago, Kruzenstern said:

I beg to differ. I thought the same, and then played the West Virigina '44 in asymmetrics just for lols, thinking she would be the same kind of turd as California, Colorado etc.

Oh boy was I wrong. I actually had never researched her and had no idea her secondaries were the good kind, and her main guns als seem more accurate than they should be. I am actually doing better in her than I am in my Massachusetts, and I am doing quite well in Massa. I think by now I have done some 10 asymmetric battles in WV and in 9 of them I have exceeded 200K damage. I think among my plethora of ships, only Schlieffen has been a more reliable performer in asymmetrics.

When asymmetrics are gone, I will try in in Operations and I suspect it will do quite well there too as a poor man's Massa.

To be fair, Asymmetric Battles represent the best-case MM possible for WV’44. Facing only tier IV-VI opponents mitigates all of her prominent disadvantages:

1) Her 127mm secondaries only have 21mm of penetration (26mm with IFHE). Tier V BBs only have 19mm extremity plating and tier VI BBs have 26mm plating that can be penned if IFHE is taken.

2) Her main battery guns have poor range and subpar penetration. Facing only lower-tier opponents not only ensures engagements take place at closer ranges against targets with generally poorer armor protection, but her AP can also overmatch any target you come across, further mitigating the effect of their poor performance.

3) Lower tier BBs tend to have slower speeds that their higher tier counterparts, so her 21 knot top speed is much easier to work with. She’s better able to dictate her engagements and reliably bring her secondaries into play than in her standard +/-2 MM spread.

WV’44 was designed as ship that can be an effective top-tier bully, but has a lot of disadvantages when facing higher tier opponents.

 

Edited January 7 by Nevermore135

[invicta2012]

39 minutes ago, Gasboy said:

Except in game it has one more gun than as built and an extra torpedo launcher.  The Brits were short on guns, so built her with 3 main battery, and one of the torpedo launchers had been removed to take on more aa/anti-submarine weaponry.  If she had not been sunk, this is likely how she would have been returned to Brazil.

She was completed with both sets of torpedo tubes, though, and Y gun was omitted to provide space for a heavy depth charge pattern rather than due a lack of guns or space. Further modifications (usually the removal of "B" gun) were made to allow the use of forward-firing ASW such as Hedgehog, and, yes, there was the AA panic in 1940 when one set of tunes was removed and 3 inch AA weapon installed. The same conversions were made to many of the interwar RN standard DDs of the A-I classes.  For example: HMS Hero (shown at this link: https://www.naval-history.net/xGM-Chrono-10DD-27H-Hero.htm) is as originally built, with 4 guns in ABXY position and two sets of torpedo tubes. As HMCS Chaudiere (https://www.canada.ca/en/navy/services/history/ships-histories/chaudiere.html) the same ship now has A and X guns only, Hedgehog in B position, one set of torpedo tubes, and some additional 6 pdr guns to deal with U Boats on the surface rather than using ramming tactics.  All the changes made were fully reversible - the main problem was that after years of convoy duty in the Atlantic the ships were just worn out. 

[Wrath_of_Deadguy]

6 hours ago, Kruzenstern said:

I actually had never researched her and had no idea her secondaries were the good kind, and her main guns als seem more accurate than they should be. I am actually doing better in her than I am in my Massachusetts, and I am doing quite well in Massa.

WV '44 is a secondary monster if you can get her in range to use them. She actually has better secondary DPM with 4x2 127mm per side than T9 Georgia has with 5x2 of the same guns and the slot 6 secondary upgrade- their base reload is just that much faster. The main guns have crappy pen values, shorter-than-average range, and floaty ballistics... but 1.8 sigma, which is normal for a BB, and 406mm is 406mm in T7, so you can still slap things around with them just fine (fewer belt pens at range, but more deck pens from plunging fire and overmatch).

I enjoy my WV. Slow BBs are at a pretty severe disadvantage in PvE, but WV holds her own and it is very, very satisfying when she gets all of her guns popping off.